From talmeta at talmeta.net Mon Dec 1 13:40:56 2003 From: talmeta at talmeta.net (Tal Meta) Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 21:40:56 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] BRP References: Message-ID: <3FCAAA38.8060101@talmeta.net> Dana Myers wrote: > > I'll look into all of them and see what I can find. As for the D&D to RQ > website, that sounds like something Tal Meta might know about... Tal, > you still here? Yeah, semi-conscious, but still about. :) I know I've done a little bit, but there were several larger offerings in the way of monster conversions. I remember a RQ/Dark Sun site, and I believe the "RQ Source" webpage had some converted spells & monsters. -- talmeta at talmeta.net - Heretic, Dilettante, & God-Machine AIM - talmeta ICQ - 12594453 Homepage - My eyes are closed. I'm seeing you with my legs. From LKirshtein at howost.com Tue Dec 9 08:48:31 2003 From: LKirshtein at howost.com (Kirshtein, Leon (Consultant)) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2003 16:48:31 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Elves vs. Trolls Message-ID: <20BE9059B6FC2D4B9E8FF2A9E2C4EEBD018472FB@HOS2KEXCHCL.howost.strykercorp.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://localhost.localdomain/pipermail/rq-rules/attachments/20031208/168feea1/attachment.html From bick10 at comcast.net Tue Dec 9 09:04:16 2003 From: bick10 at comcast.net (bick10 at comcast.net) Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2003 22:04:16 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Elves vs. Trolls Message-ID: <120820032204.28731.38af@comcast.net> > Leon > This is a cross post. > I am currently working on a scenario involving a battle between elves > and trolls and I am looking for ideas. The general outline of this > is going to be as follows: Sounds fun. > Things what I am looking for: > The maximum number of troll forces are 100 trolls and 200 trollkin (1 > clan) What would be the proper number and make up of elf forces for > this. > > Any other suggestions are welcomed. Isn't standard military thinking 4 to 1 odds when attacking? Generally the more the better. As light friends I trust it will be heavy foot to hold the Trolls at bay while the light foot (elves) do their work with bows. To many light troops to defend a fixed positions (the ceremony site) expect it to be disrupted by determined heavy foot trolls. If you want to force a major battle make it a Pass that needs to be passed. A river can be crossed elsewhere if Trolls hold the bridge. But getting back out a resupplied pass would be more trouble. Jim Bickmeyer From leonbk at yahoo.com Tue Dec 9 09:59:54 2003 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2003 14:59:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Elves vs. Trolls In-Reply-To: <120820032204.28731.38af@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20031208225954.58144.qmail@web41101.mail.yahoo.com> > Jim Bickmeyer wrote: > Isn't standard military thinking 4 to 1 odds when > attacking? Generally the more the better. That would be true if they were planning to keep the location, but in this case it is more of an in and out thing. The major engagement will be on the way out and the elves may not survive at all. > As light friends I trust it will be heavy foot to > hold the Trolls at bay while the light foot (elves) > do their work with bows. To many light troops to > defend a fixed positions (the ceremony site) expect > it to be disrupted by determined heavy foot trolls. The troll will be hampered by daylight and their attacks at this point will not be coordinated. I figure a dozen templar types backed by elven archery should keep the ceremony going for most of the day. > If you want to force a major battle make it a Pass > that needs to be passed. A river can be crossed > elsewhere if Trolls hold the bridge. But getting > back out a resupplied pass would be more trouble. I thinking of something fairly specific. Part of the scenerio is a smaller elven force holding the bridge so their commrads have a chance to get out. Leon __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. http://photos.yahoo.com/ From Aldanata at wmconnect.com Tue Dec 9 10:08:00 2003 From: Aldanata at wmconnect.com (Aldanata at wmconnect.com) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2003 18:08:00 EST Subject: [RQ-Rules] Elves vs. Trolls Message-ID: <1d8.162271c3.2d065e50@wmconnect.com> What do the Elves know about the Troll forces? If they know their numbers, they would plan differently than if they are going in blind, or less than perfectly informed. One thing that I have noticed time and again with Runequest is that numbers count. Even when dealing with Runelords, or the equivalent, the more attacks the more chances for crits. And with Trolls, crits hurt. What is the terain like at the location of the ceremony? If wooded, then the Elves would want to have harrying archery in the woods. If more open then the Elves need more numbers. Just a few thoughts. Hope they help. William -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://localhost.localdomain/pipermail/rq-rules/attachments/20031208/e9fb205c/attachment.html From leonbk at yahoo.com Tue Dec 9 10:25:01 2003 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2003 15:25:01 -0800 (PST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Elves vs. Trolls In-Reply-To: <1d8.162271c3.2d065e50@wmconnect.com> Message-ID: <20031208232501.88756.qmail@web41107.mail.yahoo.com> --- Aldanata at wmconnect.com wrote: > What do the Elves know about the Troll forces? If > they know their numbers, > they would plan differently than if they are going > in blind, or less than perfectly informed. The elves know of a small troll force guarding the crossing, but do not know the exact numbers of troll in the area. > > What is the terain like at the location of the > ceremony? If wooded, then the > Elves would want to have harrying archery in the > woods. If more open then the Elves need more numbers. No woods on this side of the river, but plenty of small hills. My initial thought on the numbers of elves are: 30 elves including 7 rune levels 50 runners/pixies/fairy thing 6 War trees 20 human templar types including 2 rune leves 6-12 adventures Leon __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. http://photos.yahoo.com/ From jurrubin at earthlink.net Tue Dec 9 09:03:24 2003 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (D. Smart) Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2003 16:03:24 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Elves vs. Trolls References: <20BE9059B6FC2D4B9E8FF2A9E2C4EEBD018472FB@HOS2KEXCHCL.howost.strykercorp.com> Message-ID: <3FD4F52C.8030400@earthlink.net> It all depends on the terrain, who controls it, whether it's day or night, and the number of runelords/priests per side. If there's plenty of cover for the elves, they can use shoot and move tactics. If it's a stand-up slugfest and there's a good defensible position (i.e. high thick walls or the equivalent) nearby that the elves can grab, than a 1 elf to 3 or 4 trolls can work. Otherwise, better make the ratios of elves to trolls 3 or 4 to 1. David Kirshtein, Leon (Consultant) wrote: > This is a cross post. > I am currently working on a scenario involving a battle between elves > and trolls and I am looking for ideas. The general outline of this > is going to be as follows: > > The elves need to perform a ceremony in a particular place, which is > located in troll held territory. > > 1.They gather some Light worshipping allies and march forward. The > initial contact is with an unprepared group of trolls in a small pass > or a bridge. > > 2. They would then precede forward secure the location and perform > the ceremony, meanwhile fighting off uncoordinated troll attacks. > > 3. The last part is the trip back and a major battle. > > Things what I am looking for: > The maximum number of troll forces are 100 trolls and 200 trollkin (1 > clan) What would be the proper number and make up of elf forces for > this. > > Any other suggestions are welcomed. > > Leon > > _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo/rq-rules From stolenbjorn at hotmail.com Tue Dec 9 23:53:55 2003 From: stolenbjorn at hotmail.com (Bjorn Stolen) Date: Tue, 09 Dec 2003 12:53:55 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Elves vs. Trolls Message-ID: I think you should let the elves have relatively many spiritual allies, and allied animals doing ahead scouting, etc. My oppinion is that elves should not meet uz opposition with brute force, rather supperior recon, speed, avoiding tactics etc. therefore, I think that the elven unit should consist of -say 20 archers, 2/3 magicians and mabye 25 bigger or smaller spirits, perhaps a wartree or two, etc. This way, the elves will be anihilated (and eaten) if entering pitch battle, and this could prove a good experience for the players? _________________________________________________________________ Last ned nye MSN Messenger 6.1 gratis http://www.msn.no/computing/messenger - Den korteste veien mellom deg og dine venner -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: "Kirshtein, Leon (Consultant)" Subject: [RQ-Rules] Elves vs. Trolls Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2003 16:48:31 -0500 Size: 3755 Url: http://localhost.localdomain/pipermail/rq-rules/attachments/20031209/be905d72/attachment.mht From stephenmcg at blueyonder.co.uk Wed Dec 10 00:44:21 2003 From: stephenmcg at blueyonder.co.uk (stephenmcg at blueyonder.co.uk) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2003 13:44:21 -0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Elves vs. Trolls Message-ID: <185975719C549A4B9961C0D59A48027302508379@ECOWV04M.Telewest.Internal> This is more difficult mechanically but by no means less worthy because of that. I would like to know how you would run such an encounter under RQ. Personally I feel that the new HeroQuest mechanics are very good for this kind of contest but it should be possible under RuneQuest too. Personally I think you need to have some abstract mechanic for the opposing strategies - possibly skills of the opposing commanders. The aldryami commander might be using some skill such as 'Hit and Run tactics' while the troll commander is using 'Find tasty elves'. I would go further and make the abilities like a stat (skill/5) and run it like a spirit combat so H&R tactics of 75% gets a 15 and Tasty Elves of 60% gets 12. The aldraymi goes first and needs under 65% to make progress - you could make a special success mean that he has laid a blind that circumvents one future success by the trolls and a critical to mean that they have made the blind and achieved better progress than expected. The troll goes second and needs 35% to make contact. A special success would mean that he has made contact with the elves while a critical would mean that they make contact and delayed them. The reduction of stats could continue like in spirit combat and when one opponent reaches zero then the other opponent has achieved their aims - the elves get to do their ceremony or the trolls bring them to a pitched battle. I think that the make-up of the forces should provide bonuses depending on their nature. If the trolls make contact then there should be a combat in which success for one side or the other provides a bonus to their respective commander - tactical data fed back to central command... That's all off the top of my head but it could make for a very different kind of game for an evening... -----Original Message----- From: rq-rules-admin at crashbox.com on behalf of Bjorn Stolen Sent: Tue 09/12/2003 12:53 To: rq-rules at crashbox.com Cc: Subject: RE: [RQ-Rules] Elves vs. Trolls I think you should let the elves have relatively many spiritual allies, and allied animals doing ahead scouting, etc. My oppinion is that elves should not meet uz opposition with brute force, rather supperior recon, speed, avoiding tactics etc. therefore, I think that the elven unit should consist of -say 20 archers, 2/3 magicians and mabye 25 bigger or smaller spirits, perhaps a wartree or two, etc. This way, the elves will be anihilated (and eaten) if entering pitch battle, and this could prove a good experience for the players? _________________________________________________________________ Last ned nye MSN Messenger 6.1 gratis http://www.msn.no/computing/messenger - Den korteste veien mellom deg og dine venner -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 5942 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://localhost.localdomain/pipermail/rq-rules/attachments/20031209/9dde4dfd/attachment.bin From stolenbjorn at hotmail.com Wed Dec 10 01:00:32 2003 From: stolenbjorn at hotmail.com (Bjorn Stolen) Date: Tue, 09 Dec 2003 14:00:32 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] elves vs. trolls -tactics Message-ID: Well, I use warhammer ancient warfare for larg scale combat-exept in runequest.... Why? because of the macig system of runequest. If you do like me; ignore petty magic of the common troopers, and just use normal RQ rules for dealing with the greater magic, it can work, because the combat system of warhammer ancient warfare is the best large scale system I've ever encountered. Dealing with elves just makes using this system even worse, thoug, due to their frequent use of magic _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail snakker ditt spr?k! http://www.hotmail.msn.com/cgi-bin/sbox?rru=dasp/lang.asp - F? Hotmail p? norsk i dag From LKirshtein at howost.com Wed Dec 10 02:34:16 2003 From: LKirshtein at howost.com (Kirshtein, Leon (Consultant)) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2003 10:34:16 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] elves vs. trolls -tactics Message-ID: <20BE9059B6FC2D4B9E8FF2A9E2C4EEBD134A61@HOS2KEXCHCL.howost.strykercorp.com> >> Dealing with elves just makes using this system even worse, thoug, due to their frequent use of magic True, but the they are fighting RQ Trolls, who can stand with them toe to toe in spirits and magic warfare. I expect the battle to take place on many levels, but I am going to abstract the magical and spiritual duels and concentrate on the physical. My biggest concern at the moment is to get the right size of the elf/allied forces. The breakdown so far is Allies: Elves - 25 Fairies - 50 Humans - 25 Wartrees - 5 Trolls: Bridge force: Trolls 8 Trollkin 20 Skirmishers(2 groups): Trolls 10 Trollkin 25 Main force(including any survivors of previous engagements): Trolls 60 (includes great trolls) Trollkin (120) Is the elfish force too strong? too weak? I want them to have an about 50/50 chance of getting out with about 60-70% casualties. Leon From alan.richards75 at ntlworld.com Wed Dec 10 03:39:32 2003 From: alan.richards75 at ntlworld.com (Alan Richards) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2003 16:39:32 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Trolls v Elves In-Reply-To: <20031208230800.23411.50079.Mailman@thinbits.com> Message-ID: <44355EFC-2A66-11D8-9D59-000A277B64F4@ntlworld.com> Standard military thinking is odds of 3:1 in attackers favourite. (which is why many modern armies are based on multiples of 3 incidently): i.e. 3 Troops (or Platoons) in a Company 3 Companies in a Commando (or Battalion) 3 Commandos in a Brigade etc. some armies have additional units at each level but these are usually support and / or headquarters units. The number of fighting 'bayonets' are based on multiples of 3 of the next unit size down. However standard thinking is also that you never use special forces to hold ground. Not only are they not equipped but their mindset is such that they would rather hunt than be hunted. Let the light cultists lead the Trolls into a game of hide and seek thin ruins/woodlands/etc. rather than all circle the wagons and wait to be chopped to bits. I'd think that the key to 'balanced' fight would be for the light cultists to attack and operate during daylight. (Surely they would not be stupid enough to fight on their enemies terms). And give plenty of opportunity for guerilla style tying up of numerically (and physically) superior Troll forces. From LKirshtein at howost.com Wed Dec 10 04:29:43 2003 From: LKirshtein at howost.com (Kirshtein, Leon (Consultant)) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2003 12:29:43 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Trolls v Elves Message-ID: <20BE9059B6FC2D4B9E8FF2A9E2C4EEBD134A62@HOS2KEXCHCL.howost.strykercorp.com> > Let the light cultists lead the Trolls into a game of hide and seek > thin ruins/woodlands/etc. rather than all circle the wagons and wait to > be chopped to bits. This is not going to work in my case. The light cultists are the least likely to be used in these type of tactics, as they are mostly hoplites. This is more of a job for the mixed adventurer-elf force > I'd think that the key to 'balanced' fight would be for the light > cultists to attack and operate during daylight. (Surely they would not > be stupid enough to fight on their enemies terms). That is a given. The problem is how long does the ceremony last. That will determine the timing of the last engagement. > And give plenty of > opportunity for guerilla style tying up of numerically (and physically) > superior Troll forces. Yes, I think I would need to expand the elves defensive perimeter to allow for a more fluid defense and a hardcore reaction force. (Can anyone say Stalingrad for a day? I knew you could.) Leon From DevinC at aol.com Wed Dec 10 06:01:07 2003 From: DevinC at aol.com (DevinC at aol.com) Date: Tue, 09 Dec 2003 14:01:07 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Trolls v Elves Message-ID: <1A82CDA9.51814416.00047AF1@aol.com> In a message dated 12/9/2003 11:39:32 AM Eastern Standard Time, alan.richards75 at ntlworld.com writes: > I'd think that the key to 'balanced' fight would be for the light > cultists to attack and operate during daylight. (Surely they would not > be stupid enough to fight on their enemies terms). And give plenty of > opportunity for guerilla style tying up of numerically (and > physically) > superior Troll forces. The light forces would play hit and run. In addition, they would mass their fire in groups calculated to take out a single opponent per round. If that means 12 shots all aimed at the same location...so be it. Devin From Aldanata at wmconnect.com Wed Dec 10 09:41:39 2003 From: Aldanata at wmconnect.com (Aldanata at wmconnect.com) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2003 17:41:39 EST Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Trolls v Elves Message-ID: <19f.1e426422.2d07a9a3@wmconnect.com> I'm assuming that the Elves will have plenty of scouts out and will know the Troll force is coming long before it gets to them. If this is the case, I believe the number to be about right. The Elves can send out a couple of harraing teams to slow down the Trolls and try to lessen the number of Trolls, while maybe demoralizing some of the Trollkin into running. IF this becomes a Head to Head slugfest, then I believe that the Elves are doomed. But it could be very dramatic to have the ritual end at the height of the battle and the crux being the Elves tryign to get an opening in the liens to excape. Give a good chance for many heroic actions. ( Gimli and Aragorn on the causeway) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://localhost.localdomain/pipermail/rq-rules/attachments/20031209/98533bd7/attachment.html From stolenbjorn at hotmail.com Thu Dec 11 01:05:41 2003 From: stolenbjorn at hotmail.com (Bjorn Stolen) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 14:05:41 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] elves vs. trolls -tactics Message-ID: > >> Dealing with elves just makes using this system even worse, thoug, due >to >their frequent use of magic > >True, but the they are fighting RQ Trolls, who can stand with them toe to >toe in spirits and magic warfare. I expect the battle to take place on >many levels, but I am going to abstract the magical and spiritual duels and >concentrate on the physical. > >My biggest concern at the moment is to get the right size of the elf/allied >forces. The breakdown so far is >Is the elfish force too strong? too weak? I want them to have an about >50/50 chance of getting out with about 60-70% casualties. > >Leon I think so, but it all comes down to the tactical options you want to give the elves (I asume the playingcharacters are with the elven fraction) I'd let down a bit on some of the force, but strongly stress the importance of recon as the uz force with diminishing the elven size wil probably win any pitched melee. Fun to have war trees, as their slow move cause more strategic problems than they solve; the ultimate thing here would be to leave all the elven forces behind, and hire in some Praxians on antilopes; they'd dash in, perform the ritual and get the h... out of dodgeville ; ) (I tend to think that the elves have the upper hand when it comes to magic, given their superior INT and strong cultural ties to nature and it's creatures. I realize that UZ have insects to resort to, but those are highly uninteligent, and cannot be used to scout ahead, as birds, foxes, wolves etc. can do for the elves) _________________________________________________________________ Last ned nye MSN Messenger 6.1 gratis http://www.msn.no/computing/messenger - Den raskeste veien mellom deg og dine venner From stolenbjorn at hotmail.com Thu Dec 11 01:12:14 2003 From: stolenbjorn at hotmail.com (Bjorn Stolen) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 14:12:14 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Trolls v Elves Message-ID: >Standard military thinking is odds of 3:1 in attackers favourite. The fun (-but allso the frustrating) thing with gloranthan RQ is that the world is too full of wierd things to be able to generalize the battles into this forumla that works fine for the strategists of NATO. I red somthing about gloranthan warfare that it is such a magically stron world, that huge armies rarely mass, due to the vulnerabelity it have to huge spells. I liked the article, as it presented an excuse for the GM (that would be me) to skip epic battles, and rather use clashes, encounters with a maximum total of partipicants of ...say 1000. Much easier and cheaper to handle boardgames involving 50 - 200 pieces than the epic ones (I am the one using Warhammer Ancient Battles to solve huge battles in my RQ campagin) _________________________________________________________________ MSN Messenger http://www.msn.no/messenger - Den korteste veien mellom deg og dine venner From LKirshtein at howost.com Fri Dec 12 04:29:12 2003 From: LKirshtein at howost.com (Kirshtein, Leon (Consultant)) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:29:12 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Trolls v Elves Message-ID: <20BE9059B6FC2D4B9E8FF2A9E2C4EEBD0184731C@HOS2KEXCHCL.howost.strykercorp.com> >> Standard military thinking is odds of 3:1 in attackers favourite. > The fun (-but allso the frustrating) thing with gloranthan RQ is that the world is too full of wierd things to be able to generalize the battles into this forumla that works fine for the strategists of NATO. I red somthing about gloranthan warfare that it is such a magically stron world, that huge armies rarely mass, due to the vulnerabelity it have to huge spells. > I liked the article, as it presented an excuse for the GM (that would be me) to skip epic battles, and rather use clashes, encounters with a maximum total of partipicants of ...say 1000. Much easier and cheaper to handle boardgames involving 50 - 200 pieces than the epic ones (I am the one using Warhammer Ancient Battles to solve huge battles in my RQ campagin) I think the presence of magic makes the nature of Gloranthan warfare much more like our present day "high tech" warfare. So you will still get the large army formations, but a battle would have a different meaning and would be more like WWII and later engagements than the ancient history ones. Leon From andrew at crashbox.com Fri Dec 12 06:54:31 2003 From: andrew at crashbox.com (Andrew Mellinger) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 11:54:31 -0800 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Trolls v Elves In-Reply-To: <20BE9059B6FC2D4B9E8FF2A9E2C4EEBD0184731C@HOS2KEXCHCL.howost.strykercorp.com> Message-ID: On 12/11/03 9:29 AM, "Kirshtein, Leon (Consultant)" wrote: > >>> Standard military thinking is odds of 3:1 in attackers favourite. > >> The fun (-but allso the frustrating) thing with gloranthan RQ is that the >> world is too full of wierd things to be able to generalize the battles into >> this forumla that works fine for the strategists of NATO. I red somthing >> about gloranthan warfare that it is such a magically stron world, that huge >> armies rarely mass, due to the vulnerabelity it have to huge spells. > > I think the presence of magic makes the nature of Gloranthan warfare much more > like our present day "high tech" warfare. So you will still get the large > army formations, but a battle would have a different meaning and would be more > like WWII and later engagements than the ancient history ones. I have always like Glen Cook's Black Company series for descriptions of battle that include strong magical types. Granted there were only a few strong magic types, but it showed how they integrated well with the combat. -Andrew From stolenbjorn at hotmail.com Fri Dec 12 09:32:30 2003 From: stolenbjorn at hotmail.com (Bjorn Stolen) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:32:30 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Trolls v Elves Message-ID: >I think the presence of magic makes the nature of Gloranthan warfare much >more like our present day "high tech" warfare. So you will still get the >large army formations, but a battle would have a different meaning and >would be more like WWII and later engagements than the ancient history >ones. > >Leon I don't intend to start quarreling on this, but allthough I could see some vauge resembelanse to modern warfare, I find the Gloranthan macical world far more erratic, unpredictable, culturally diverse and chaotic than the present digital world, where warfare is becoming so predictable that I bet the computers in your Pentagon can predict the exact number of casualties you americans will suffer when going in somewhere... Yes, I see similarities: range, flying capability, dimentions that vaugely resembeles internet, electronic warfare and propaganda, but the elements listed in my too long sentence above weighs heavier in my oppinion. In My glorantha, the equvalent of an Apache helicopter (say a powerful Lunar magician) never quite knows what his "Saddam"-opponent can pull out of his sleeve.... That's why I still claims that the 3:1 odds cannot be applied automatically by the GM. I'd say glorantha is exactly like our world, exept that faith and religion actually works! _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail snakker ditt spr?k! http://www.hotmail.msn.com/cgi-bin/sbox?rru=dasp/lang.asp - F? Hotmail p? norsk i dag From Aldanata at wmconnect.com Fri Dec 12 12:43:31 2003 From: Aldanata at wmconnect.com (Aldanata at wmconnect.com) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:43:31 EST Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Trolls v Elves Message-ID: <191.2300477a.2d0a7743@wmconnect.com> If we were talking a D&D mass battle, then the magics would greatly influence the outcome. But with the exception of soem Divine magic, most of the Runequest magic is individual affecting rather than group affecting. I agree with an earlier writer who says that the magics and spirits and elementals will equal each other out. The only needle in teh straw would be if one side had heavy sorcery on their side. In that case the favor could be swayed to their side with preplanned spells. This would be of particular importance if the Elves had the Mages. With their high INT and soem spell matrixes, they could greatly influence the battle. Between Damage Boostings and Damage resistances, coupled with Diminishes and Enchances, they would be a force to be reckoned with. They could hold odds of 5 to 1 or greater. This is assuming that the Trolls did not have access to Mages also. (I do love to be an instigator) William -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://localhost.localdomain/pipermail/rq-rules/attachments/20031211/c8f68e2f/attachment.html From leonbk at yahoo.com Fri Dec 12 13:34:05 2003 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 18:34:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Trolls v Elves In-Reply-To: <191.2300477a.2d0a7743@wmconnect.com> Message-ID: <20031212023405.42115.qmail@web41113.mail.yahoo.com> --- Aldanata at wmconnect.com wrote: > The only needle in teh straw would be if one side had heavy > sorcery on their side. In that case the favor could > be swayed to their side with preplanned spells. > This would be of particular importance if the Elves > had the Mages. With their high INT and soem spell > matrixes, they could greatly > influence the battle. Between Damage Boostings and > Damage resistances, > coupled with Diminishes and Enchances, they would be > a force to be reckoned with. Depends on the rules you are using. With RQ3 yes, but that is a broken system to start with > They could hold odds of 5 to 1 or greater. This is > assuming that the Trolls > did not have access to Mages also. I tend to play RQ in Glorantha, so there are a lot more trolls knowing sorcery than elves. Leon __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. http://photos.yahoo.com/ From stolenbjorn at hotmail.com Fri Dec 12 18:52:31 2003 From: stolenbjorn at hotmail.com (Bjorn Stolen) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:52:31 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Trolls v Elves Message-ID: >From: Aldanata at wmconnect.com >Reply-To: rq-rules at crashbox.com >To: rq-rules at crashbox.com >Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: Trolls v Elves >Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:43:31 EST > >If we were talking a D&D mass battle, then the magics would greatly >influence >the outcome. But with the exception of soem Divine magic, most of the >Runequest magic is individual affecting rather than group affecting. I >agree with >an earlier writer who says that the magics and spirits and elementals will >equal each other out. The only needle in teh straw would be if one side >had heavy >sorcery on their side. William Whatever happened to divine intervention and the fact that Glorantha with all sourcebooks operates with well over 100 gods? (Make me shut up If the setting is not in Glorantha...) _________________________________________________________________ Last ned nye MSN Messenger 6.1 gratis http://www.msn.no/computing/messenger - Den korteste veien mellom deg og dine venner From stolenbjorn at hotmail.com Fri Dec 12 18:58:11 2003 From: stolenbjorn at hotmail.com (Bjorn Stolen) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:58:11 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Trolls v Elves Message-ID: What allso frustrates me is that everybody knows magic in RQ, and that is really difficult to scale up! The RQ system has so strong enphasis on individuality that I find it hard to make up one bunch of -say 100 darktrolls that knows bludgeon3, heal 1 and darkwall, etc. And since the INT stat on elves IS HIGHER (=store for more spells) than on trolls, the averidge Aldryami archer should have the high ground magically vs. the averidge Dark Troll opponent. _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail snakker ditt spr?k! http://www.hotmail.msn.com/cgi-bin/sbox?rru=dasp/lang.asp - F? Hotmail p? norsk i dag From tiberius at runequest.za.org Fri Dec 12 20:36:28 2003 From: tiberius at runequest.za.org (tiberius at runequest.za.org) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 11:36:28 +0200 (SAST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] New Adventure Message-ID: <17606.196.8.104.37.1071221788.squirrel@mail.wack.co.za> Greetings fellow RuneQuesters and assorted skum of the galaxy! For the festival of Saturnalia, I have uploaded a special present to my site. Go to http://www.runequest.za.org/article/articleview/124/1/0 and download the hack and slash adventure Wergild Worries. As always, all feedback is most welcome. Please note that if you are looking for some pansy assed, glorantha creatured, namby pamby, lardi dah, high sorcery adventure, don't bother. This is for the characters who believe in the strength of their thews and the steel of their sword! Happy slaying! Cheers Tony -- Vacca Foeda! From mikko.korhonen at efecte.fi Tue Dec 9 22:27:33 2003 From: mikko.korhonen at efecte.fi (Mikko Korhonen EFECTE) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2003 13:27:33 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Elves vs. Trolls Message-ID: Hi gang! The initial shock attack could include elf commandos with their deadly bows and short spears. After securing the place they could do the following: Elves could use war trees and strangling vines (etc) to boost their numbers. I can allready see elves performing a small ceremony over enchanted seeds, which turn into full sized trees in just a few minutes. Size would be somewhere around a small forest, depending of course the area which they want to secure. And of course the "Guardian" forest would be full of pixies, runners, strangling vines plus all the nasty forest thingies you can imagine. Maybe even earth elementals. If you are playing in Glorantha, trolls would then counter with fire wielding Zorak Zorani berserkers ;) Another idea that came in to my mind is that elves could use some sort of avian cavalty, maybe pegasi or griffins. This could be a result of the ceremony. Or maybe some Elf Lord DI's and gets the divine help in the form lf this avian cavalty. They could also use flying creatures in the end of the ritual to get the key characters out. Cheers, Mikko -----Original Message----- From: Kirshtein, Leon (Consultant) [mailto:LKirshtein at howost.com] Sent: 8. joulukuuta 2003 23:49 To: rq-rules at crashbox.com Subject: [RQ-Rules] Elves vs. Trolls This is a cross post. I am currently working on a scenario involving a battle between elves and trolls and I am looking for ideas. The general outline of this is going to be as follows: The elves need to perform a ceremony in a particular place, which is located in troll held territory. 1.They gather some Light worshipping allies and march forward. The initial contact is with an unprepared group of trolls in a small pass or a bridge. 2. They would then precede forward secure the location and perform the ceremony, meanwhile fighting off uncoordinated troll attacks. 3. The last part is the trip back and a major battle. Things what I am looking for: The maximum number of troll forces are 100 trolls and 200 trollkin (1 clan) What would be the proper number and make up of elf forces for this. Any other suggestions are welcomed. Leon _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo/rq-rules From LKirshtein at howost.com Sat Dec 13 03:10:09 2003 From: LKirshtein at howost.com (Kirshtein, Leon (Consultant)) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 11:10:09 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Mass combat Message-ID: <20BE9059B6FC2D4B9E8FF2A9E2C4EEBD134A63@HOS2KEXCHCL.howost.strykercorp.com> >>Whatever happened to divine intervention and the fact that Glorantha with all sourcebooks operates with well over 100 gods? (Make me shut up If the setting is not in Glorantha...) In Glorantha the gods will not interfere vs. other gods, due to The Compromise. So any DI will only effect their own worshippers on the battlefield. The affect of this would be a more prolonged engagement there a number of people would be brought back to life and the losing side would have fair chance of getting out of combat. In this type of environment, Holy Sites are the major areas of strategic and tactical importance, since they are staging and resupply areas. So a major war effort will become a series of deep strikes vs. the enemies rear while putting pressure all along the front line Leon From LKirshtein at howost.com Sat Dec 13 03:16:38 2003 From: LKirshtein at howost.com (Kirshtein, Leon (Consultant)) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 11:16:38 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Magic and warfare Message-ID: <20BE9059B6FC2D4B9E8FF2A9E2C4EEBD01847330@HOS2KEXCHCL.howost.strykercorp.com> >> What allso frustrates me is that everybody knows magic in RQ, and that is really difficult to scale up! The RQ system has so strong emphasis on individuality that I find it hard to make up one bunch of -say 100 darktrolls that knows bludgeon3, heal 1 and darkwall, etc. And since the INT stat on elves IS HIGHER (=store for more spells) than on trolls, the average Aldryami archer should have the high ground magically vs. the average Dark Troll opponent. Since the magic is so personal and the majority of it effects just the skills and/or the damage of the person. You can factor it into the units stats. So for example in the case of elves vs. trolls the units may have the same initial combat ratings but the elves' rating would degrade faster since their it is derived more from magic which has limited duration. Leon From gloomshark at hotmail.com Sat Dec 13 07:14:34 2003 From: gloomshark at hotmail.com (Dana Myers) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 20:14:34 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ hero questing Message-ID: Hello again, I was perusing some of the RQ sites out there on the web, and noticed on Richard Meints' lists that Different Worlds 4 had some actual information published on Hero Questing in RQ. Does anyone know of any other published sources of information like this on how they were actually thinking of implementing HQ?ing? Thanks, Dana _________________________________________________________________ Cell phone ?switch? rules are taking effect ? find out more here. http://special.msn.com/msnbc/consumeradvocate.armx From leonbk at yahoo.com Sat Dec 13 09:30:46 2003 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 14:30:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Elves vs. Trolls In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20031212223046.60321.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> --- Mikko Korhonen wrote: > Elves could use war trees and strangling vines (etc) > to boost their numbers. I can allready see elves > performing a small ceremony over enchanted seeds, > which turn into full sized trees in just a few > minutes. Yes, this would be an important tactical advantage even if it just changes the terran. > Size would be somewhere around a small > forest, depending of course the area which they want > to secure. More like a grove on a hill top. > And of course the "Guardian" forest would > be full of pixies, runners, strangling vines plus > all the nasty forest thingies you can imagine. Vines plus nasty things yes. Pixies, runners maybe. > Maybe even earth elementals. Not here, but available. > Another idea that came in to my mind is that elves > could use some sort of avian cavalty, maybe pegasi > or griffins. This could be a result of the ceremony. > Or maybe some Elf Lord DI's and gets the divine help > in the form lf this avian cavalty. They could also > use flying creatures in the end of the ritual to get > the key characters out. Nice idea, but not possible in this case. Leon __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. http://photos.yahoo.com/ From soltakss at yahoo.com Wed Dec 17 23:59:27 2003 From: soltakss at yahoo.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?Simon=20Phipp?=) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:59:27 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: RQ-Rules digest, Vol 1 #224 - 8 msgs In-Reply-To: <20031209173000.6238.56806.Mailman@thinbits.com> Message-ID: <20031217125927.75764.qmail@web9601.mail.yahoo.com> This might be a bit late, but you never know. Leon: > My biggest concern at the moment is to get the right size of the = > elf/allied forces. The breakdown so far is > > Allies: > Elves - 25 > Fairies - 50 > Humans - 25 > Wartrees - 5 > > Trolls: > > Bridge force: > Trolls 8 > Trollkin 20 > > Skirmishers(2 groups): > Trolls 10 > Trollkin 25 > > Main force(including any survivors of previous engagements): > Trolls 60 (includes great trolls) > Trollkin (120) > > Is the elfish force too strong? too weak? I want them to have an about = > 50/50 chance of getting out with about 60-70% casualties. Depends on the tactics. Trollkin will stand back and lob slingstones at anyone exposed, so even though they may not be very skilled their numbers will tell over time. Trolls will send spirits in or go in mob-handed with their awesome combat spells cast. Generally, I would assume that a 1:1 combat trolls/elves means the elves lose. 1:2 means a draw and anything else means the elves win. Trollkin count as 1 elf in missile combat and half an elf in hand to hand. Runners and Pixies count as half a trollkin in any combat. Adventurers count as 1 troll as they are normally tougher. Great Trolls and War Trees are equivalent in hand to hand so they would cancel each other out. As to the Rune levels, stick a couple of Yelmalians in there and give them Sunbright - that will keep the trollkin away. Use Lightwall spells as much as possible to shield from trollkin missiles. Yelmalians are not particularly good in hand to hand and Aldrya/High King Elf cultists are better at missile combat, so try and pick people with Arrow Trance and loads of bow magic. The adventurers will be the key force here as they will be able to stand up to the trolls and the trollkin horde. I would say that the current elven force would be pretty much slaughtered - they might finish the ceremony but they would not get out. Trolls are mean and trollkin are under estimated. Simon ________________________________________________________________________ BT Yahoo! Broadband - Save ?80 when you order online today. Hurry! Offer ends 21st December 2003. The way the internet was meant to be. http://uk.rd.yahoo.com/evt=21064/*http://btyahoo.yahoo.co.uk From soltakss at yahoo.com Wed Dec 17 23:59:54 2003 From: soltakss at yahoo.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?Simon=20Phipp?=) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 12:59:54 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: RQ-Rules digest, Vol 1 #224 - 8 msgs In-Reply-To: <20031209173000.6238.56806.Mailman@thinbits.com> Message-ID: <20031217125954.17186.qmail@web9610.mail.yahoo.com> This might be a bit late, but you never know. Leon: > My biggest concern at the moment is to get the right size of the = > elf/allied forces. The breakdown so far is > > Allies: > Elves - 25 > Fairies - 50 > Humans - 25 > Wartrees - 5 > > Trolls: > > Bridge force: > Trolls 8 > Trollkin 20 > > Skirmishers(2 groups): > Trolls 10 > Trollkin 25 > > Main force(including any survivors of previous engagements): > Trolls 60 (includes great trolls) > Trollkin (120) > > Is the elfish force too strong? too weak? I want them to have an about = > 50/50 chance of getting out with about 60-70% casualties. Depends on the tactics. Trollkin will stand back and lob slingstones at anyone exposed, so even though they may not be very skilled their numbers will tell over time. Trolls will send spirits in or go in mob-handed with their awesome combat spells cast. Generally, I would assume that a 1:1 combat trolls/elves means the elves lose. 1:2 means a draw and anything else means the elves win. Trollkin count as 1 elf in missile combat and half an elf in hand to hand. Runners and Pixies count as half a trollkin in any combat. Adventurers count as 1 troll as they are normally tougher. Great Trolls and War Trees are equivalent in hand to hand so they would cancel each other out. As to the Rune levels, stick a couple of Yelmalians in there and give them Sunbright - that will keep the trollkin away. Use Lightwall spells as much as possible to shield from trollkin missiles. Yelmalians are not particularly good in hand to hand and Aldrya/High King Elf cultists are better at missile combat, so try and pick people with Arrow Trance and loads of bow magic. The adventurers will be the key force here as they will be able to stand up to the trolls and the trollkin horde. I would say that the current elven force would be pretty much slaughtered - they might finish the ceremony but they would not get out. Trolls are mean and trollkin are under estimated. Simon ________________________________________________________________________ BT Yahoo! Broadband - Save ?80 when you order online today. Hurry! Offer ends 21st December 2003. The way the internet was meant to be. http://uk.rd.yahoo.com/evt=21064/*http://btyahoo.yahoo.co.uk From esoteric at crashbox.com Sat Dec 20 11:12:44 2003 From: esoteric at crashbox.com (Brad Furst) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2003 16:12:44 -0800 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet Message-ID: >To: rqaddicts at yahoogroups.com >Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2003 07:23:43 -0800 (PST) >Subject: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet >Reply-To: rqaddicts at yahoogroups.com > >Here: http://www.cc.jyu.fi/~tosalmi/Runequest/ From jurrubin at earthlink.net Sun Dec 21 23:48:56 2003 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (D. Smart) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 06:48:56 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet References: Message-ID: <3FE596B8.6020904@earthlink.net> AWESOME! Thank you! David Smart Brad Furst wrote: >> To: rqaddicts at yahoogroups.com >> Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2003 07:23:43 -0800 (PST) >> Subject: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet >> Reply-To: rqaddicts at yahoogroups.com >> >> Here: http://www.cc.jyu.fi/~tosalmi/Runequest/ > > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo/rq-rules > From lancelot at inetnebr.com Mon Dec 22 00:14:46 2003 From: lancelot at inetnebr.com (lance dyas) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 07:14:46 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet In-Reply-To: <3FE596B8.6020904@earthlink.net> References: <3FE596B8.6020904@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <3FE59CC6.1060602@inetnebr.com> Well somebody got to it before it vanished... D. Smart wrote: > AWESOME! Thank you! > > David Smart > > Brad Furst wrote: > >>> To: rqaddicts at yahoogroups.com >>> Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2003 07:23:43 -0800 (PST) >>> Subject: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet >>> Reply-To: rqaddicts at yahoogroups.com >>> >>> Here: http://www.cc.jyu.fi/~tosalmi/Runequest/ >> >> -- Lance Dyas Google Me under : Lost Worlds Roleplaying -- Lance Dyas Lost Worlds Roleplaying - at the Decision Driven Gaming Center http://www.dyasdesigns.com/roleplay/LostWorlds From leonbk at yahoo.com Mon Dec 22 11:45:12 2003 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:45:12 -0800 (PST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Dragon Claw In-Reply-To: <20031013221749.71013.qmail@web9601.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20031222004512.24412.qmail@web41106.mail.yahoo.com> Martial Arts, Dragon Claw + A successful martial arts roll while attacking with a dragon sword allows a second attack with the other sword in the same round in addition to any other action. + A successful martial arts roll while parrying with a dragon sword allows a second parry with the other sword in the same round in addition to any other action. + Dragon Sword - Hooked sword, usually golden in color and extremely sharp. DAM - 1d8+1, AP - 10 SR - 2 ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. http://photos.yahoo.com/ From pascal.dury at fr.unisys.com Mon Dec 22 23:39:26 2003 From: pascal.dury at fr.unisys.com (Dury, Pascal) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 06:39:26 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet Message-ID: Is it me or that link is a non english nor french web site ? Anybody have an english translation ? Pascal -----Message d'origine----- De : rq-rules-admin at crashbox.com [mailto:rq-rules-admin at crashbox.com] De la part de Brad Furst Envoy? : samedi 20 d?cembre 2003 01:13 ? : rq-rules at crashbox.com Objet : [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet >To: rqaddicts at yahoogroups.com >Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2003 07:23:43 -0800 (PST) >Subject: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet >Reply-To: rqaddicts at yahoogroups.com > >Here: http://www.cc.jyu.fi/~tosalmi/Runequest/ _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo/rq-rules From gerall at chromebob.com Mon Dec 22 23:47:30 2003 From: gerall at chromebob.com (Gerall Kahla) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 06:47:30 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3FE6E7E2.4050907@chromebob.com> Dury, Pascal wrote: > Is it me or that link is a non english nor french web site ? > > Anybody have an english translation ? [snip] >> >>Here: http://www.cc.jyu.fi/~tosalmi/Runequest/ I believe that's Finnish... Or at least that's what I suspect from the *.fi in the address. I am not fluent in Finnish, sorry! Pax -- -- [gerall kahla] / [http://chromebob.com/] [programmer] / [celestial mechanic] From ghoyle1 at airmail.net Mon Dec 22 23:59:43 2003 From: ghoyle1 at airmail.net (Guy Hoyle) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 06:59:43 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3FE6EABF.6020209@airmail.net> Dury, Pascal wrote: >Is it me or that link is a non english nor french web site ? > >Anybody have an english translation ? > > More importantly, did anybody manage to grab a copy before it disappeared? Guy From jurrubin at earthlink.net Tue Dec 23 02:57:12 2003 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 09:57:12 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet Message-ID: <22059433.1072108632718.JavaMail.root@bigbird.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Yesss and it's MINE, my precciousss! Fortunately, 'tis the season to be giving and Gollum I ain't. *grin* The .pdf is 35.5Mb, or about 8.7Mb zipped. And it's in English and to be drooled over. I can resend it tonight if someone has a website they can be post it to for further downloading. I'd normally be happy to email it to other people but my ISP's server has a low email per user limit. Sending it once pretty much eats up my allotment. Any volunteers? First one gets it so please be sure you can post for everyone else to access. David -----Original Message----- From: Guy Hoyle Sent: Dec 22, 2003 6:59 AM To: rq-rules at crashbox.com Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet Dury, Pascal wrote: >Is it me or that link is a non english nor french web site ? > >Anybody have an english translation ? > > More importantly, did anybody manage to grab a copy before it disappeared? Guy _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo/rq-rules From dahak at dahak.free-online.co.uk Wed Dec 24 22:50:00 2003 From: dahak at dahak.free-online.co.uk (Adam Canning) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2003 11:50:00 -0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Happy Message-ID: <3FE97D68.12854.1FDBBA@localhost> Happy Christmas/Chanuka/Saturnalia/Kwanzaa/Crimson Bat Day* -- Adam * Delete as inappropriate. -- Adam "I hate weather. Did I mention that? Rev...You're a monk. Correct me if I'm wrong, but if the Divine had wanted us to suffer through weather, he would have never have given us space travel. Am I right?" -Beka From ghoyle1 at airmail.net Wed Dec 24 23:18:37 2003 From: ghoyle1 at airmail.net (Guy Hoyle) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2003 06:18:37 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Happy In-Reply-To: <3FE97D68.12854.1FDBBA@localhost> References: <3FE97D68.12854.1FDBBA@localhost> Message-ID: <3FE9841D.2090506@airmail.net> Adam Canning wrote: >Happy Christmas/Chanuka/Saturnalia/Kwanzaa/Crimson Bat Day* > > > And Festivus for the rest of us! Guy From lancelot at inetnebr.com Thu Dec 25 01:06:50 2003 From: lancelot at inetnebr.com (lance dyas) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2003 08:06:50 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Happy In-Reply-To: <3FE9841D.2090506@airmail.net> References: <3FE97D68.12854.1FDBBA@localhost> <3FE9841D.2090506@airmail.net> Message-ID: <3FE99D7A.4010009@inetnebr.com> Well I do "Happy Holidays" myself.. and though not "everyone" is celebrating life and love and joy at this time... its a pretty good call. Guy Hoyle wrote: > Adam Canning wrote: > >> Happy Christmas/Chanuka/Saturnalia/Kwanzaa/Crimson Bat Day* >> >> >> > And Festivus for the rest of us! > > Guy > -- Lance Dyas Google Me under : Lost Worlds Roleplaying -- Lance Dyas Lost Worlds Roleplaying - at the Decision Driven Gaming Center http://www.dyasdesigns.com/roleplay/LostWorlds From grogthing at yahoo.com Thu Dec 25 01:06:51 2003 From: grogthing at yahoo.com (grogthing) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2003 06:06:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Happy In-Reply-To: <3FE9841D.2090506@airmail.net> Message-ID: <20031224140651.75269.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> Hey, dont forget Happy Yule!. Hope everyone has a godd holiday whatever it may be. Greg --- Guy Hoyle wrote: > Adam Canning wrote: > > >Happy Christmas/Chanuka/Saturnalia/Kwanzaa/Crimson > Bat Day* > > > > > > > And Festivus for the rest of us! > > Guy > > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo/rq-rules __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. http://photos.yahoo.com/ From esoteric at crashbox.com Thu Dec 25 02:46:28 2003 From: esoteric at crashbox.com (Brad Furst) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2003 07:46:28 -0800 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet In-Reply-To: <3FE6EABF.6020209@airmail.net> References: <3FE6EABF.6020209@airmail.net> Message-ID: >Dury, Pascal wrote: >>Is it me or that link is a non english nor french web site ? >>Anybody have an english translation ? >More importantly, did anybody manage to grab a copy before it disappeared? >Guy I did. But then I also had a legitimate paper playtest-copy. I have been sworn to share only with my playtest group's players. Sorry in advance. -- Brad Furst esoteric at crashbox.com From leonbk at yahoo.com Thu Dec 25 02:58:48 2003 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2003 07:58:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Happy In-Reply-To: <3FE99D7A.4010009@inetnebr.com> Message-ID: <20031224155848.68492.qmail@web41115.mail.yahoo.com> Happy Holidays everyone. Leon --- lance dyas wrote: > Well I do "Happy Holidays" myself.. and though not > "everyone" is > celebrating life and love and joy at this time... > its a pretty good call. > > > Guy Hoyle wrote: > > > Adam Canning wrote: > > > >> Happy > Christmas/Chanuka/Saturnalia/Kwanzaa/Crimson Bat > Day* > >> > >> > >> > > And Festivus for the rest of us! > > > > Guy > > > -- > Lance Dyas > > Google Me under : Lost Worlds Roleplaying > > -- Lance Dyas > Lost Worlds Roleplaying - at the Decision Driven > Gaming Center > http://www.dyasdesigns.com/roleplay/LostWorlds > > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo/rq-rules __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. http://photos.yahoo.com/ From jurrubin at earthlink.net Thu Dec 25 05:14:39 2003 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2003 12:14:39 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet Message-ID: <32056360.1072289679521.JavaMail.root@kermit.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Soooo..any idea as to when the playtest will be completed and RQIV publicly available? David Smart -----Original Message----- From: Brad Furst Sent: Dec 24, 2003 9:46 AM To: rq-rules at crashbox.com Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet >Dury, Pascal wrote: >>Is it me or that link is a non english nor french web site ? >>Anybody have an english translation ? >More importantly, did anybody manage to grab a copy before it disappeared? >Guy I did. But then I also had a legitimate paper playtest-copy. I have been sworn to share only with my playtest group's players. Sorry in advance. -- Brad Furst esoteric at crashbox.com _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo/rq-rules From grogthing at yahoo.com Thu Dec 25 07:15:04 2003 From: grogthing at yahoo.com (grogthing) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2003 12:15:04 -0800 (PST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet In-Reply-To: <32056360.1072289679521.JavaMail.root@kermit.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20031224201504.11249.qmail@web41510.mail.yahoo.com> I thought that the project was dead years ago and that the incomplete playtest copies were public domain now? Greg --- David Smart wrote: > Soooo..any idea as to when the playtest will be > completed and RQIV publicly available? > > David Smart > > -----Original Message----- > From: Brad Furst > Sent: Dec 24, 2003 9:46 AM > To: rq-rules at crashbox.com > Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV > available on the internet > > >Dury, Pascal wrote: > >>Is it me or that link is a non english nor french > web site ? > >>Anybody have an english translation ? > >More importantly, did anybody manage to grab a copy > before it disappeared? > >Guy > > I did. But then I also had a legitimate paper > playtest-copy. I have > been sworn to share only with my playtest group's > players. Sorry in > advance. > -- > > Brad Furst > esoteric at crashbox.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo/rq-rules > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo/rq-rules __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. http://photos.yahoo.com/ From esoteric at crashbox.com Thu Dec 25 07:32:58 2003 From: esoteric at crashbox.com (Brad Furst) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2003 12:32:58 -0800 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet In-Reply-To: <32056360.1072289679521.JavaMail.root@kermit.psp.pas.earthlink.net> References: <32056360.1072289679521.JavaMail.root@kermit.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: >Soooo..any idea as to when the playtest will be completed and RQIV >publicly available? > >David Smart Never. :-( The project is dead, strangled by three-way disputes among the authors and Hasbro and Greg Stafford. Better for you to get Steve Perrin's SPRQ rules. >-----Original Message----- >From: Brad Furst >Sent: Dec 24, 2003 9:46 AM >To: rq-rules at crashbox.com >Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet > >>Dury, Pascal wrote: >>>Is it me or that link is a non english nor french web site ? >>>Anybody have an english translation ? >>More importantly, did anybody manage to grab a copy before it disappeared? >>Guy > >I did. But then I also had a legitimate paper playtest-copy. I have >been sworn to share only with my playtest group's players. Sorry in >advance. -- Brad Furst esoteric at crashbox.com From esoteric at crashbox.com Thu Dec 25 07:34:23 2003 From: esoteric at crashbox.com (Brad Furst) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2003 12:34:23 -0800 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet In-Reply-To: <20031224201504.11249.qmail@web41510.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20031224201504.11249.qmail@web41510.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: >I thought that the project was dead years ago True. >and that >the incomplete playtest copies were public domain now? In my communications with the authors, they had never released their copyright to public domain. -- Brad Furst esoteric at crashbox.com From steve at perrinworlds.com Thu Dec 25 07:50:17 2003 From: steve at perrinworlds.com (Steve Perrin) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2003 12:50:17 -0800 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet References: <32056360.1072289679521.JavaMail.root@kermit.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <004401c3ca5f$99b33bb0$f4407442@wizard> Not that it makes a lot of difference, but it's SPQR. Stands for Steve Perrin's Quest Rules, a name suggested on this list, as a matter of fact. Steve Perrin www.perrinworlds.com/SPQR.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brad Furst" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2003 12:32 PM Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet > >Soooo..any idea as to when the playtest will be completed and RQIV > >publicly available? > > > >David Smart > > Never. > :-( > The project is dead, strangled by three-way disputes among the > authors and Hasbro and Greg Stafford. Better for you to get Steve > Perrin's SPRQ rules. > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: Brad Furst > >Sent: Dec 24, 2003 9:46 AM > >To: rq-rules at crashbox.com > >Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet > > > >>Dury, Pascal wrote: > >>>Is it me or that link is a non english nor french web site ? > >>>Anybody have an english translation ? > >>More importantly, did anybody manage to grab a copy before it disappeared? > >>Guy > > > >I did. But then I also had a legitimate paper playtest-copy. I have > >been sworn to share only with my playtest group's players. Sorry in > >advance. > > -- > > Brad Furst > esoteric at crashbox.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo/rq-rules > From jurrubin at earthlink.net Thu Dec 25 07:53:45 2003 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2003 14:53:45 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet Message-ID: <24079760.1072299225665.JavaMail.root@kermit.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Well, that pretty much kills it then. I grabbed a copy, thinking it was public domain, and was going to post it to a website but not if the authors refuse to release their copyright on something that'll never go commercial. Sorry, people, but I don't feel like becoming a lawyer's test case. I've worked too long and hard to lose it all if one or more of the authors decides to throw a snit. As far as I'm concerned, the authors have killed RQ just as surely as Hasbro did. My downloaded copy of the RQIV .pdf has been deleted. David -----Original Message----- From: Brad Furst Sent: Dec 24, 2003 2:34 PM To: rq-rules at crashbox.com Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet >I thought that the project was dead years ago True. >and that >the incomplete playtest copies were public domain now? In my communications with the authors, they had never released their copyright to public domain. -- Brad Furst esoteric at crashbox.com _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo/rq-rules From esoteric at crashbox.com Thu Dec 25 08:22:10 2003 From: esoteric at crashbox.com (Brad Furst) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2003 13:22:10 -0800 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Fwd: [rqaddicts] RQ:IV available on the internet In-Reply-To: <24079760.1072299225665.JavaMail.root@kermit.psp.pas.earthlink.net> References: <24079760.1072299225665.JavaMail.root@kermit.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: >Well, that pretty much kills it then. My downloaded copy of the RQIV >.pdf has been deleted. > >David Yikes! I only reported as much as I know as a playtester. For all we know, whoever uploaded to the Finnish (?) site may have had permission. %-) Who knows? The file there has disappeared and reappeared a few times since I first encountered it. >I grabbed a copy, thinking it was public domain, and was going to >post it to a website but not if the authors refuse to release their >copyright on something that'll never go commercial. Such disputes over distribution rights are frequently temporary. Right now, you can't purchase The Name of the Rose on DVD, but later it may be available. Titles go in and out of distribution. Just because The Name of the Rose is not available now, does not mean I need to discard my Laserdisk copy or my VHS copy. Rutger Hauer's (or should I state? Jennifer Jason Leigh's) Flesh + Blood has been unavailable for years, but now it will be available this coming February. >Sorry, people, but I don't feel like becoming a lawyer's test case. >I've worked too long and hard to lose it all if one or more of the >authors decides to throw a snit. As far as I'm concerned, the >authors have killed RQ just as surely as Hasbro did. Perhaps you have more information than I. Your post sounds rather bitter. :-( By the by, the Hasbro replacement to RuneQuest, RuneQuest Slayers, was available on the web for awhile, maybe even still. I didn't like it, never played it. But you could look for that one, too. Greg Stafford commercial replacement to RQ, HeroQuest, is currently available in fine game stores and by mail order from Steve Jackson Games. RQ4:AiG was not substantially different than other folks' house rules, and in fact rather crippled much of RQ, especially sorcery and weapons, armor, and damage in combat. -- Brad Furst esoteric at crashbox.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://localhost.localdomain/pipermail/rq-rules/attachments/20031224/ff70404d/attachment.html From Alain.RAMEAU at total.com Fri Dec 26 20:21:19 2003 From: Alain.RAMEAU at total.com (RAMEAU Alain) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2003 10:21:19 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Another RQIV link Message-ID: The link I got on my site for the old RQIV draft version (which in fact was more a version 3.5) is : http://members.aol.com/Ethesis/mw2/hero/he1/rqiv.htm There was also a link to a RQIV (maybe the same ?) from Robert Stancliff website but the link to his site is not working anymore. Alain http://karamo.nexenservices.com/glowar/rq.htm -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://localhost.localdomain/pipermail/rq-rules/attachments/20031226/972473b7/attachment.html From alan.richards75 at ntlworld.com Sun Dec 28 01:22:01 2003 From: alan.richards75 at ntlworld.com (Alan Richards) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2003 14:22:01 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] greetings In-Reply-To: <20031224140800.1727.41843.Mailman@thinbits.com> Message-ID: <0982726F-3878-11D8-A4AB-000A277B64F4@ntlworld.com> Dear all I am going to break the cardinal rule of newsgroup netiquette, apologies for this, by setting down thoughts on several topics in no particular order. One 'Happy Holidays' My parents lived in the US for a number of years and when I visited them around December the phrase 'happy holidays' used to drive me nuts. Partly because it smacked of "lets reduce all these festivals to a commercial opportunity." And partly because one particularly uptight US citizen had a real go at me for saying 'Happy Christmas' to a Christian vicar! This is in the most racially segregated nation I have visited (and yes that includes South Africa and No I haven't visited Jerusalem or Dubrovnik). However two weeks ago I went on a course at work, one of the other delegates was an ethnically Indian lad (ethnically but not nationally; I for one have not got the cross of St. George tattooed on my neck as he has!) who complained that he wished everyone a 'Joyous Divalli' (spelling?) but no one ever wished him a 'Merry Christmas'. So I am beginning o think that 'Happy Holidays' is as good a greeting as any other! Secondly Runequest 4 (or RQ4, RQIV, AiG, or .. you get the idea) This newsgroup and the RQ Addicts group seem to be split into two camps. Those who have a copy of the above manuscript, and who for moral or legal reasons don't feel comfortable passing it on. And Those (like me) who don't have it but would dearly like to. (Even if just to look at 'new' rules and say 'actually I prefer my house rule'). There is a classic (and out of print) 80's RPG. Called Dragon Warriors (DW) sold in six books. For various reasons the Sixth (and best) book was not marketed as widely and lots of fans never got hold of a copy. The author (and copyright holder) gave permission for a PDF document to be uploaded to the Yahoo group for DW. Does anyone know who is the copyright holder to RQ4 (or RQIV, etc.)? Has anyone attempted to contact him/her/it/them and ask if a similar thing might be done? I would LOVE to have a copy. But I would not like to pressure anyone who doesn't feel comfortable (legally or morally) to pass one my way. Alan From steve at perrinworlds.com Sun Dec 28 06:12:25 2003 From: steve at perrinworlds.com (Steve Perrin) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2003 11:12:25 -0800 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RuneQuest IV copies References: <0982726F-3878-11D8-A4AB-000A277B64F4@ntlworld.com> Message-ID: <012001c3ccad$6d9585b0$f4407442@wizard> The closest thing to a copyright holder on RuneQuest these days is Greg Stafford. Last I heard, his Issaries Inc (?) managed to persuade Hasbro to give the title trademark back to him. Also last time I heard, from Greg, he hadn't figured out what to do with it. Since he didn't much like the final result of RQIV, getting his permission to make a copy of RQIV (assuming he has any real claim) is problematic. I just don't know. It might be legally possible to issue the manuscript as Adventures in Glorantha after excising all mentions of RuneQuest. Greg certainly has claim to the Glorantha name, so I could be wrong about this, but I doubt he has trademarked the Adventures in Glorantha name. I am not a trademark expert or lawyer, however. If you are looking for the Glorantha/RuneQuest connection, I believe it was the manuscript's portrayal of Gloantha that Greg most objected to. Steve Perrin www.limitedchaos.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alan Richards" To: Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2003 6:22 AM Subject: [RQ-Rules] greetings > Dear all > > I am going to break the cardinal rule of newsgroup netiquette, > apologies for this, by setting down thoughts on several topics in no > particular order. > > One 'Happy Holidays' > > My parents lived in the US for a number of years and when I visited > them around December the phrase 'happy holidays' used to drive me nuts. > Partly because it smacked of "lets reduce all these festivals to a > commercial opportunity." And partly because one particularly uptight US > citizen had a real go at me for saying 'Happy Christmas' to a Christian > vicar! This is in the most racially segregated nation I have visited > (and yes that includes South Africa and No I haven't visited Jerusalem > or Dubrovnik). > > However two weeks ago I went on a course at work, one of the other > delegates was an ethnically Indian lad (ethnically but not nationally; > I for one have not got the cross of St. George tattooed on my neck as > he has!) who complained that he wished everyone a 'Joyous Divalli' > (spelling?) but no one ever wished him a 'Merry Christmas'. So I am > beginning o think that 'Happy Holidays' is as good a greeting as any > other! > > > Secondly Runequest 4 (or RQ4, RQIV, AiG, or .. you get the idea) > > This newsgroup and the RQ Addicts group seem to be split into two camps. > > Those who have a copy of the above manuscript, and who for moral or > legal reasons don't feel comfortable passing it on. > > And > > Those (like me) who don't have it but would dearly like to. (Even if > just to look at 'new' rules and say 'actually I prefer my house rule'). > > > There is a classic (and out of print) 80's RPG. Called Dragon Warriors > (DW) sold in six books. For various reasons the Sixth (and best) book > was not marketed as widely and lots of fans never got hold of a copy. > The author (and copyright holder) gave permission for a PDF document to > be uploaded to the Yahoo group for DW. > > Does anyone know who is the copyright holder to RQ4 (or RQIV, etc.)? > Has anyone attempted to contact him/her/it/them and ask if a similar > thing might be done? > > I would LOVE to have a copy. But I would not like to pressure anyone > who doesn't feel comfortable (legally or morally) to pass one my way. > > > > Alan > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo/rq-rules > From grogthing at yahoo.com Mon Dec 29 08:55:48 2003 From: grogthing at yahoo.com (grogthing) Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2003 13:55:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] RuneQuest IV copies In-Reply-To: <012001c3ccad$6d9585b0$f4407442@wizard> Message-ID: <20031228215548.40735.qmail@web41503.mail.yahoo.com> From paul at profax.co.nz Mon Dec 29 18:50:08 2003 From: paul at profax.co.nz (Paul Heinz) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2003 20:50:08 +1300 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RuneQuest IV copies In-Reply-To: <20031228215548.40735.qmail@web41503.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Greg wrote: > From what I understand having been on a game designer > list in the past, is that game mechanics do not fall > under copyright laws. Ie... any game can use a d20 > rolling mechanic or a percentile one, etc... > > So could someone strip out text bits and just pass on > a copy of the final mechanics? Well, I have an official playtest (i.e. paper) copy of the AIG rules as well as an electronic copy. Note that the RQ IV draft and RQ AIG draft have quite sizeable differences. Whilst stripping the text bits and posting the remnants would be somewhat dubious legally (and more importantly, really tedious for me to do :-), I can easily post summaries of the interesting changes and perhaps the occasioanl 'fair-use' snippet for review and criticism which is permitted. What sorts of RQ:AIG changes would people be interested in summaries of? An answer of 'all the changes' is not that helpful as a way to prioritise :-) Broad categories of changes off the top of my head: Derived attributes changed a little bit Skills changed quite a bit Prior Experience changed completely Magic changed a bit Weapons and Armour changed a little bit etc. TTFN, Paul. From rog_benham at hotmail.com Mon Dec 29 22:20:06 2003 From: rog_benham at hotmail.com (Roger Benham) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2003 11:20:06 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RuneQuest IV copies Message-ID: An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://localhost.localdomain/pipermail/rq-rules/attachments/20031229/94eb8010/attachment.html From lancelot at inetnebr.com Tue Dec 30 01:56:56 2003 From: lancelot at inetnebr.com (lance dyas) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2003 08:56:56 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RuneQuest IV copies In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3FF040B8.8050102@inetnebr.com> Paul Heinz wrote: > >Whilst stripping the text bits and posting the remnants would be somewhat >dubious legally (and more importantly, really tedious for me to do :-), > Aye, and that is probably "A" point of the copyright law, the effort of creating an in your own words version of a game is analogous to writing it in the first place ---> though obviously the creativity and originality of composing the ideas and concepts are not involved.... ideas cannot be copyright "only a specific, non trivial expression" is the mantra... Rumor has it the laws in Europe are different but evolving to the same thing... -- Lance Dyas Google Me under : Lost Worlds Roleplaying -- Lance Dyas Lost Worlds Roleplaying - at the Decision Driven Gaming Center http://www.dyasdesigns.com/roleplay/LostWorlds From grogthing at yahoo.com Tue Dec 30 02:09:39 2003 From: grogthing at yahoo.com (grogthing) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2003 07:09:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] RuneQuest IV copies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20031229150939.88359.qmail@web41507.mail.yahoo.com> The skill usage and experience is what interests me most. Greg --- Paul Heinz wrote: > Greg wrote: > > > From what I understand having been on a game > designer > > list in the past, is that game mechanics do not > fall > > under copyright laws. Ie... any game can use a d20 > > rolling mechanic or a percentile one, etc... > > > > So could someone strip out text bits and just pass > on > > a copy of the final mechanics? > > Well, I have an official playtest (i.e. paper) copy > of the AIG rules as well > as an electronic copy. Note that the RQ IV draft and > RQ AIG draft have quite > sizeable differences. > > Whilst stripping the text bits and posting the > remnants would be somewhat > dubious legally (and more importantly, really > tedious for me to do :-), I > can easily post summaries of the interesting changes > and perhaps the > occasioanl 'fair-use' snippet for review and > criticism which is permitted. > > What sorts of RQ:AIG changes would people be > interested in summaries of? > An answer of 'all the changes' is not that helpful > as a way to prioritise > :-) > > Broad categories of changes off the top of my head: > > Derived attributes changed a little bit > Skills changed quite a bit > Prior Experience changed completely > Magic changed a bit > Weapons and Armour changed a little bit > etc. > > TTFN, > Paul. > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo/rq-rules __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. http://photos.yahoo.com/ From MurfNMurf at aol.com Wed Dec 31 11:53:30 2003 From: MurfNMurf at aol.com (MurfNMurf at aol.com) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2003 19:53:30 EST Subject: [RQ-Rules] Most Memorable Combat Message-ID: Hi gang, I've been reading through the old RQ list (from 96 maybe?) archives, cadging bits here and there, and discovered while reading that I wanted to reply to stuff, only to remember it is *years* old :) Anyhow, as the current stuff on this list about RQAiG, copyright law and the like doesn't strike *me* as particularly fascinating, I thought I'd bring up a subject which I *did* enjoy reading about on the old RQ list; that of Most Memorable Combat. My most memorable combat happened as a player back in the early 80's under RQ2. My favorite character was Beowulf (yes, I *know* its a decidedly unoriginal name), a runt of an Elf mercenary based on those in the Marvel comic "Weirdworld" (by one of my favorite artists, Mike Ploog) and the cheezy Bakshi film "Wizards". Anyhow, he was among a small group of mercs who'd been forced to hide when the City State which'd been employing them fell to a siege. To teach the locals a lesson, the victors from the neighboring Evil Empire decided to search out and roundup any surviving authority figures associated with the city (including the poor *hired help*) and help them sluff off their mortal coils in a number of awful ways (impalement, beheading, roasted on spit and fed to the Trolls, etc). Deciding they'd *eventually* be found out and executed, the gang decided it was time to leave town. In the process of the siege and later trying to escape, they'd been pared down to less than a half dozen characters and a few recurring NPCs (including some in desperate need of either more powerful healing magics or effective medical aid). It was decided horses were required.So, Beowulf and a couple of companions descended on a large set of stables. Unfortunately the Empire had already taken control of the stables (along with most of the rest of the city), and a squad of Imperial troopers was guarding the joint along with a very tough Troll mercenary the gang had encountered during a previous mercenary ticket. A pretty savage melee ensued, with no mention of ransoms being made, and after several rounds Beowulf and the Troll were the only ones left standing. Several more rounds followed, each occasionally injuring the other; Beowulf backing off to repeatedly apply Healing 2s or 3s or 4s; the Troll regenerating a scary 6pts per location per melee, until the Troll managed to shattered Beowulf's leg after backing him into an empty stall. Beowulf managed a lucky strike from the ground; almost bisected the Troll's torso and knocking it flat. With the Troll down, Beowulf managed to crawl toward the stairs, hoping to make it to the hay loft, where he might *just* have enough time to Heal before the Troll recovered and came for him. Having reduced his MP on earlier Healings, Beowulf was then unable to fix his maimed leg, but did manage to staunch the considerable bleeding as the Troll recovered and advanced. Staggering to his feet, the katana-weilding Elf managed to take off the Troll's arm above the elbow. The Troll swung his maul at the Elf's head; about to pulp it, when Beowulf managed a parry. His katana was shattered, and he was knocked loopy (and down) by the blow to his head. The Troll closed and attempted to smash Beowulf into the floor from above, but at the last second the Elf came out of his stupor and managed to dodge/roll away. The Troll tried a few more times, with the Elf again succeeding in avoiding his fate; maneuvering away again and again. Beowulf looked for anything to use as a weapon; finally seeing a pitchfork firmly stuck into a large mound of hay on the far side of the loft.. The recent maneuvering had torn open his leg wound, and he was bleeding away pretty quickly (to, IIRC, 4 total HP), but managed to barely outrace the Troll coming up behind him. With unconsciousness from blood loss approaching at the end of that round, Beowulf managed to critically hit the Troll's chest with his final strike. Killing the Troll dead at last. One of Beowulf's companions who'd been injured in the earlier melee managed to finally Heal himself a few minutes later, and went in search of his friend. Breaking out his 2nd Healing potion, the companion managed to find the Elf, and Heal him right before the irrevocably maimed feature of maimings in RQ occurred. With the Troll firmly pinned to the floor of the loft, it couldn't regenerate, and thankfully stayed dead until the Elf and his companion removed the horror's head and threw it down a well. The gang at last had their horses, and managed to escape the city after some sabre-clanging combat with a couple of Imperial cavalrymen; several Imperial footmen having been trampled in the rush through the gates. Whew! That's it. Best. -Ken- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://localhost.localdomain/pipermail/rq-rules/attachments/20031230/8324d6d3/attachment.html