From: owner-rq-rules-digest To: rq-rules-digest@hops.wharton.upenn.edu Subject: RQ Rules Digest: V2 #68 Reply-To: rq-rules Errors-To: owner-rq-rules-digest Precedence: bulk Content-Return: Prohibited Return-Path: owner-rq-rules-digest RQ Rules Digest: Wednesday, 13 September 1995 Volume 02 : Number 068 TABLE OF CONTENTS Graydon wow even more DI POPEJ@cofc.edu Alternate Settings for RQ Hugh Foster DI Havard Kristoffersen Alternate Settings for RQ Alain_RAMEAU_at_03__paris__t focus/casting spells Frederic J Moulin wow even more DI Frederic J Moulin Alternate Settings for RQ Loren Miller Alternate Settings for RQ Loren Miller RQ alternate settings rstaats@mail.lmi.org Bad GMs continued ... the horror, the horr RULES OF THE ROAD 1. Do not include large sections of a message in your reply. Especially not to add "Yeah, I agree" or "No, I disagree." Or be excoriated. If someone writes something good and you want to say "good show" please do. But don't include the whole message you praise. 2. Use an appropriate Subject line. 3. Learn the art of paraphrasing: Don't just quote and comment on a point-by-point basis. When paraphrasing you demonstrate exactly how well you understand the point someone was trying to make. 4. There is no number 4. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Graydon Date: Wed, 13 Sep 1995 00:18:02 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: wow even more DI On Wed, 13 Sep 1995, David Cake wrote: > Which as it stands, I either agree with or disagree with depending > on what you mean by 'personal salvation'. > If it means that Humakt will, under some conditions, save you, but > that he will not always do so - then sure, I agree. > If it means that Humakt will never grant DIs the primary effect of > which is to save a Humakti from death, then I disagree. Strongly. I even What I mean by 'personal salvation' is that Humakt will never grant a DI that is for the purpose of saving his worshipper's life. If saving the worshippers life is required to fulfill the DI, he _will_ do that. (if you've taken an oath to kill so-and-so in the upcoming battle and someone else gets you first and you DI, for instance, I think you might well get your life saved, but if you *don't* kill so-and-so, you drop dead. (and your soul goes to the bad place.)) > think that to do so devalues the Humakt cult, making merely a cult of death > without a guiding ethos, rather than a cult of honourable warriors who are > not afraid of death. 'Not afraid' is putting it rather too weakly, in my opinion; Humakti have an elaborate code of honour to keep them from killing the wrong people (which is where most elaborate codes of honour start), but they're actively in the business of _causing_ death. You don't hire mercenaries who are honourable but inept if you can help it. Humakt will be mightily peeved with you if you kill _anyone_ by stealth (the distinction between 'murder' and 'killing' in Saxon and Scandiavian law codes comes to mind), or if you violate the terms of a formal duel, or suchlike. The guiding ethos is killing _in the right ways_. > I disagree on the teleport point. For several reasons, the major one > being that I feel to limit DI only to 'appropriate' things takes away most > of the reasons why I want DI in the game in first place. DI is able to do > anything that your players can not do, but that you want to allow them to do. In game terms, DIs are a horrible kludge that shouldn't exist. In character terms, DIs are extreme things that involve a miraculous expression of faith - pretty chancy anyway. > I also disagree that he doesn't care if you die. He just doesn't > think about it anything like the terms people do. Sometimes his worshippers > dieing is inconvenient and he may help you put off the inevitable, sometimes > he encourages it. This implies that Humakt can plan for the future; what's 'future' to a god who lives in a timeless place? > Here is a simple logical exercise for you - if Humakti (and Humakt) > have the concept of 'a good day to die' (we seem to agree they do), then > they logically must have a corresponding concept of a bad day to die. Then > think of some examples of what might constitute such a bad day. Then you > have some examples of situations where Humakt might rescue his worshippers. Bad days to die are when you are in a state of sin - broken oaths, breaking cult laws (same deal, really), tainted by chaos, whatever, in which case you are certainly not going to get a DI unless you repent. The Humakti ideal is to live so that _every_ day is a good day to die. The exception being those circumstances in which dying would violate your sworn word, in which case Humakt will help you try to fulfill your oath. > It is not your version of the Humakti ethos that I disagree with, > but your seeming lack of imagination in terms of the wide variety of > situations in which DI might be called for. If you need a bright light or to breathe water, Humakt can't help you, is my view of DIs. Gods have pretty solidly limited schticks, and they're stuck with them. The Humakt cult (not called that, but it's the same god) in the campaign I run has rune lords who are legally dead - you make Sword, they hold the funeral, your heirs inherit your lands and much of your property (but not the cult's property.) They _don't_ have the attitudes of a 20th century post-enlightenment rationalist towards death, they certainly *do* believe in, vehemently and violently, absolutes, and they worship the personification of a particularly absolute absolute - death. Death is their cult's creat mystery, it's the _goal_, to live so well that your death is perfect. By 20th century rationlist standards, they're all insane suicidal lunatics. By Gloranthan standards, they're great guys to have around. saundrsg@qlink.queensu.ca | Monete me si non anglice loquobar. ------------------------------ From: POPEJ@cofc.edu Date: Wed, 13 Sep 1995 01:33:31 -0500 (EST) Subject: Alternate Settings for RQ I noticed in reading the "statement of purpose" (or whatever the correct term is) for this list that one of its functions is discussion of non- Gloranthan settings for RQ. Browsing through the tables of contents for previous digests, however, I've not found much on this topic. There seem to have been a number of discussions of whether or not Runequest should be tied to Glorantha and some discussions of what Fantasy Europe/Earth products could or should be produced. But as far as I can tell from subject-lines, there has been little or no posting of details of campaign settings (of course, subject-lines are often misleading). My question is--would anyone besides myself be interested in seeing such material appear? I can easily see why people might object to it: if you are not running a campaign set in Kievan Rus or Southern Gaul c. 300 B.C. you might have no interest in exploring the details of such a setting. Nonetheless, some people may feel (as I do) that such background information about alternate settings is often fascinating reading. From some hints I've read on the list (someone recently mentioned a Celtics campaign) I suspect there is a fair amount of stuff out there gathering dust (or whatever files on floppy disks do). There is, of course, the alternative of posting teasers and then e-mailing the details privately. Frankly, I'm personally against this, except for very long posts. My reasons are entirely selfish--I'm stuck with an old, primitive e-mail system which is difficult to use. If I must go to the trouble of typing a multi-page essay in, I want to get some mileage out of it. Jonas Pope popej@cofc.edu ------------------------------ From: Hugh Foster <100326.446@compuserve.com> Date: 12 Sep 95 14:59:12 EDT Subject: DI On DI; >> Hercules "flight" from the underworld included his taking Cerberus with him, so it was not as precipitate as all that << Absolutely! And he only left because there was nobody left who'd fight him. I feel that, like many other features of a RPG, the results of DI should be ultimately goverened by what the referee feels fits the flow and drama of the story. Not to allow players to "smart bomb" / "get out of jail free" out of crappy situations; nor yet to allow the GM to hose the poor saps. If it reads right, then do it. Frex, the party goes to do [whatever], fights nobly, achieves much, rescues the dragon from the princess, what have you, but, at the climax, the mission is in danger of getting scragged. A faithful priest or whatever calls dramatically on his god to help, pointing out how much the party have achieved. The GM evaluates how much the party deserves to be rescued. (Trans: whether it suits the god to act). Then; the earth god sends an avalanche to block their enemies from reaching them; the sky god sends a fog to cover their retreat, etc. Example 2; the party's idiot (of course there's always one!) finds the largest storm bull or whatever, and, for no proper reason, picks a fight, despite having a light sword and no armour. Just as he's about to be reduced to cutlets, he cries out to his god to save him. Squelch. These are extremes, but they illustrate my approach to DI. It's no different to having powerful NPCs with the party; do they save everyone ? BTW the only DI in my last campaign, over three years, was a relatively green character (and player) who, having used Summon/Control earth elemental on a minor basis with some success, went nuts one day and overdid it when the party was getting trashed. Fair enough, I did allow Ullr to dig him out; but he had to make his d100 roll under POW and was reduced to 8. Oddly, there was no rush of volunteers to emulate this rather Pyrrhic escape. ------------------------------ From: Havard.Kristoffersen@nrk.no (Havard Kristoffersen) Date: Wed, 13 Sep 1995 12:52:33 -0500 Subject: Re: Alternate Settings for RQ I don't think it's very important to use any sort of RQ setting at all. Most of the stuff that describes settings aren't game spesific in any case. Except for NPC and monster stats one can very well use the settings from any gaming system. I also don't see the point of using an histical look-alike earth since this planet has never had much magic. So using magic to the extent we use it in RQ would crash with historical facts (as we know them). The best setting I ever saw is Forgotten Realms, an AD&D world. Now we can all dislike TSR as much as we like, but using their settings feel pretty good. There's also quite a few books in this setting that can give some neat ideas for adventures. Forgotten Realms has a considerable variety of lands, cities and wilderness, and they seem to have used pretty good authors and illustrators (they probably got too much money to spend) as well, which certainly adds to the athmosphere of the play. If you haven't looked at the FR setting I would advise you to do so, even if the AD&D system itself stinks bigtime. Havard Hoyaas Kristoffersen Havard@NRK.no NRK - TEDB Tel: Bj. Bjornsons Plass 1 Work: +47 22 45 87 82 N-0340 OSLO Home: +47 22 67 92 00 ------------------------------ From: Alain_RAMEAU_at_03__paris__tep@internet.total.fr Date: Wed, 13 Sep 95 14:36:43 MET Subject: focus/casting spells Does a character need to have hands free to cast spells ? For sorcery spells, my answer would be yes, as gesture is necessary IMO, and sometimes (always ?) speaking too. For divine spells, as the power comes from the gods, and as warrior gods should allow a lord to cast spell with weapons in his hands, I do not think big gestures are necessary. For spirit spells, the only obligation I require from the characters is to be in contact with his focus by ANY sense (touch, smell, hearing, taste, sight). This allows many kinds of focii, and not only tatoos or similar carved runes. As an example, I take the harmonize spell of a satyr: for me, the focus is a melody to play with its pan-pipe. Then the satyr is in contact with its focus by hearing the song (therefore, I do not think unrealistic to give a bonus for casting the spell if the player achieve a very good dice roll with his Play Instrument skill). An other example could be the use of the taste sense: a spell can only be casted if the character chew some kind of herb, or drink some kind of beverage, and so forth. More standard focus can be touch contact with a material or substance. So, when the character obtain a new spell, he has to choose the kind of focus he wants (or let have the shaman impose it !). Alain. (Easier Email address than the heading one: alain_rameau@total.fr ) ------------------------------ From: "Frederic J Moulin" Date: Wed, 13 Sep 1995 10:50:14 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: wow even more DI > If it means that Humakt will, under some conditions, save you, but > that he will not always do so - then sure, I agree. > If it means that Humakt will never grant DIs the primary effect of > which is to save a Humakti from death, then I disagree. Strongly. I even > think that to do so devalues the Humakt cult, making merely a cult of death > without a guiding ethos, rather than a cult of honourable warriors who are > not afraid of death. The Red Goddess will teach you that she had to heal Humakt from its irrepressible attraction to death, even the "unworthy" one. The cult you're describing in your post is the cult of Yanafal Tarnils, one of the seven mothers and the "healed" version of Humakt. The two cults are extremely similar, but YT does belive that it is better for his followers to live and fight another day, and so will grant DI to escape a certain death or accept Resurrection of his followers. He does'nt however gives Sever Spirit as a reusable spell. True humakti spit on YT worshippers, that do not belive that death is good by itself, without any meaning or purpose. Maybe the teaching of the Red Moon is starting to influence your thoughts, you should not read all those riddles that Greg the Red E-mail to you ;-) Fred ------------------------------ From: "Frederic J Moulin" Date: Wed, 13 Sep 1995 11:08:21 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Alternate Settings for RQ > If you haven't looked at the FR setting I would advise you to do so, even if > the AD&D system itself stinks bigtime. I have personally used the Middle-Earth settings to play RuneQuest. ICE publish, IMO, the best settings and scenario after RuneQuest (at least most of the time: remember the lost city...) plus it is extremely easy to converte things and you can enhance the RQ sorcelery system with the Laws spells quite easily. We had a lot of fun because the ICE Middle-earth world is so well described and coherent, a lot less "cave running and treasure plundering" than what I experienced with the Forgotten Realms, and every one of us has read The Lord of The Rings. Now a word of advice: if you go to Rolemaster instead of MERP, you are going to spend gazillions of money to buy the 10-15 gamemater companions, laws... and they are soo poorly organized. Try to find the olds MERP modules, and not the new campaign setting. Griffin Island introduces the Orcs and the cult of Red Eye (aka Sauron himself), but it is much better described in MERP. Fred ------------------------------ From: "Loren Miller" Date: Wed, 13 Sep 1995 12:47:41 EST Subject: Re: Alternate Settings for RQ Please, please, please DO post alternate settings for RQ. If you're running RQ/Tekumel and have things to add to Sandy's rules, or if you're running RQ/Greyhawk or RQ/Forgotten Realms or RQ/Byzantium, then please DO post your comments, war-stories, questions, etc. - -- +++++++++++++++++++++++23 Loren Miller Life at the water's edge is the real life for men and women, and penguins ------------------------------ From: "Loren Miller" Date: Wed, 13 Sep 1995 12:56:12 EST Subject: RQ alternate settings Oh, one thing though. If you want to post an entire new setting for RQ, unless it contains a LOT of rules-specific information it would probably be better received on the world-design mailing lists, also at the same host. - -- +++++++++++++++++++++++23 Loren Miller Life at the water's edge is the real life for men and women, and penguins ------------------------------ From: rstaats@mail.lmi.org Date: Wed, 13 Sep 95 13:21:48 EST Subject: Bad GMs continued ... the horror, the horror... Greetings! Here is the second half of the posting as promised. Rich This portion is entitled ``The Convention'' The last couple of tidbits are from a gaming convention I attended several years ago. it was truly an adventure, and it was one of the only times I've executed a bootlegger reverse since leaving the test track in Heidenheim, Germany. Eric Zylstra, Joe Wyzorek and I headed out for a gaming convention. I had gone up the year before, had a great time and found rooms in abundance at all the local motels, but when Joey, Eric and I showed up, nothing was available. (It turned out that there was a big boating extravaganza the same weekend.) Undaunted, we started calling around. The typical conversation with a motel attendant went something like this. Attendant: We haven't got any rooms, but you might try blah-X and blah-Z. They're probably filled up too, but it doesn't hurt to try. Then, there is always the Spar-tan Inn. It is sure to have rooms, but -- well, er -- you don't *want* to stay there. Rich: Tell me about this ``Spar-tan Inn.'' Attendant: Look, if you go there, I didn't tell you too, OK? Rich and Joey: [shrug] OK. Joey: Rich, this Spartan Inn sounds like a *bad* place. Let's call blah-X and blah-Z. Invariably these places were filled up, but finally I did find a cottage that was available for only $30 per night! That is when disaster struck in my conversation with the owner. Owner: Great! So that will be a reservation for three. Now, who exactly will be staying? Rich: Myself, Rich Staats (S-T-A-A-T-S) -- the mastercard is in my name, Eric Zylstra (Z-Y-L-S-T-R-A) and Joe Wyzorek --- Owner: What! You want three young men from *Boston* staying in my cabin together? There is only one bed! Rich: That is OK, we brought along sleepin --- Owner: NOT IN MY HOTEL! (*click*) Bzzzzzzzzz..... After that, ``not in my hotel'' became a common catch phrase in the gaming group for ``no way, no how!'' :-) Unfortunately, at the time it was less humorous (though still funny), because we still needed to find a room. As one would expect for any doughty adventuring party, we ended up at the dread --- Spar-tan Inn! The sky became overcast, and streams of rain fell from leaden clouds as we rode into the sleepy hamlet. We parked the car in an overgrown, public lot. A fish eyed attendant asked us where we were bound for. When I replied ``the Spartan Inn,'' he croaked ``no charge!'' The attendant smiled with a grin too wide for a normal, healthy human countenance and showed more teeth than I had ever seen in one mouth at one time. I shuddered and longed for the warm sun of Boston as Eric, Joey and I shuffled slowly ever closer to the Spar-tan Inn. The villagers regarded us with suspicious glances as we walked up the street. When we turned toward the Spar-tan Inn though, those few on the streets quickly darted into doorways and the dark warrens lining this section of town. An old cripple, who had made his nest for the night in the doorway of the Inn, grabbed my arm with his retched, knotted hand as I reached out for the latch. ``Don't go in there sonny! You'll be sorry!'' he warned. I patted his hand and thanked him kindly for his advice as I used my sinister hand to open the latch and swing back the door. Portions of the worm eaten lintel crumbled and fell as the door swung into the yawning darkness. A fetid odor, an unholy combination of peppermint and burned liver and onions, assailed Eric, Joey and myself as our collective eyes attempted to penetrate the eldritch, unlit gloom beyond. The cripple moaned and hobbled away, dragging himself with his arms. The silence stretched for several heartbeats before a horrid keening sound chilled us to the marrow. The sound came again, a hideous mockery of human speech. Every instinct in my body told me to dart away and escape the terror that lay within, but from somewhere deep inside me, at the very core of my being, a voice said ``Rich, it will be *cheap* I bet!'' With resolute step, I entered. Eric and Joey huddled together outside the confines of the Inn glancing suspiciously in the doorway and back toward the car. My gaze met the source of the keening sound. It was bipedal. The ``body'' was draped in a greasy cloth. Spatters of blood, syrup and mustard covered the cloth in a pattern my mind could not decipher. The body was topped by a misshapen spheroid. The surface of the spheroid or ``head'' was pale and translucent. Blue veins bulged from the surface and looked like the river system of some alien world not meant to be seen by mortal eyes. A tuft of stringy white fur adorned the crown of the head. Two large, veined flaps of skin or cartilage projected from the sides of the head, not quite symmetric and disturbing. Small tufts of white fur grew from these flaps at random points. The eyes, my God, the eyes. They were completely white, cataract and ulcerated. Yet, they focused on me immediately as I entered. My heart froze in my chest, and I didn't realize I was holding my breath until I nearly fainted. Sound issued again from the thing. The smell of peppermint mixed with decay wafted through the air. I was nearly unhinged by the encounter, and my intellect sought to grasp onto any thread of sanity or hint of pattern or form. I clung to the sounds and thought there was some sense to them. Was it my imagination or did the thing say ``room?'' I averted my gaze from the hideous monstrosity and said ``three for two nights.'' A chill ran up my spine and covered my body in goosepimples as the thing chortled and screeched ``that will be grand! Don't get many visitors here. Not a superstitious fellar are yea?'' I did not answer, but the thing went on ``give yea the best room in the house I will. You shall live like kings.'' A grizzled ``hand'' stretched toward me though the arm or tentacle behind the hand was hidden under the sinuous folds of grimy cloth. With some trepidation I reached out and took the heavy skeleton key. The key was composed of some silvery metal. It was heavier than pewter and shown with some type of inner illumination. Inscribed in blackface on the key was the number ``13.'' I longed to look back on my companions for support, but I dared not turn my back on the creature here in its very lair, the center of its strength. I asked ``should we pay now?'' Before the words had fully left my mouth, a claw darted forth from the dark fabric and scratched my wrist. A trickle of blood ran down my hand as the thing replied ``pay when you leave in what form suits you.'' I ran outside. The cold, clammy air of that village seemed like a wholesome tonic to my gasping lungs. Eric asked ``Rich, did we get a room?'' ''Yes,'' I replied ``We have room thirteen.'' Joey said ``You're kidding, right? Rich, this place gives me the creeps. Was this some type of setup? I bet that's it Eric. Rich came up here last week and set this whole thing up.'' I said ``let's put the bags up'' without answering Joey's query. Eric noticed the cut on my wrist and added ``Rich, did you cut yourself?'' I said ``Yeah, watch the door, it has some rough spots around the edges.'' We made our way up the rickety steps of the Spar-tan Inn and came to the door. We opened the door, and true to its word, the thing had given us a truly magnificent room. The heady smells of cedar and pine greeted us as we entered the pristine, well lit room. There were two beds and a cot. The room had air conditioning, a king sized bath and its own sauna. There was a microwave and a refrigerator. Internally I wondered how much it would cost us and what the form of payment would be. I did not ponder for very long as the tendrils of lethe reached up to us, and we passed into comatose slumber. The next morning we made our way to the convention. There was no sign of the guardian of the inn as we made our way out to the vehicle, and the door to the parking attendants shack blew in the wind as we left the parking lot. Eric and I stuck together while Joey went his own way at the convention. Eric and I had signed up to do a ``Call of Cthulhu'' adventure with one of the premier module authors. The assembled players were an interesting lot. The topic of discussion when Eric and I entered was ``what is the worst thing that has happened to you in your life?'' The first lad volunteered ``I had to strangle my pet cat one time. It was rabid. You would be surprised how long a cat will last when you are choking the shit out of it.'' Eric and I glanced at each other as the next youth chimed in ``once I saw greater Cthulhu --- I lost all my sanity on that one! Man, that was the scariest thing that ever happened to me.'' He sat down and the vapid look in his eyes confirmed every detail of his tale. I was roused from my reverie as a perfect bound edition of the CoC rules whizzed by my head, striking the wall behind me and leaving the twisted gore of a squashed bot fly as the rules slid to the floor. I cast a questioning eye at the ``missileer''. He answered my questioning gaze by saying ``hey, it's perfectly safe. I do that shit all the time at my house. I kill hornets there for fun. I open up the screen door a little bit and let a couple in. Then, I get a couple of books and sit back and nail the f*ckers.'' Eric remarked what a good shot he was and slapped me on the shoulder adding ``Rich doesn't mind that kind of thing.'' As I glared back at Eric, the keeper entered the room. The session began well enough. I acted as the caller for the group. We seemed to be making decent progress when the keeper announced ``well, this is the half way point, and boy have you guys boned this one up!'' The group glanced around each other with questioning looks, and I asked ``what do you mean?'' The keeper tilted back in his chair and said ``you're never going to finish; that's what I mean. Are you guys stupid or did it not occur to you to talk to the ski patrol as the very first thing?'' I said ``OK, well that is a good hint, and we'll do that as the first thing after the break.'' I noticed that another hapless fly had entered the room eager to avoid any wounds due to friendly fire. The whole module appeared to be linear in fashion without room for deviation of any kind. The trail led from the ski patrol to an obscure member of the ski resort staff and onward without any obvious means of connection that our group could fathom, and at last the keeper said ``well hell, I'll just say that somehow you made it to the final encounter.'' The keeper seemed to have an unhealthy appetite for the subject matter at hand in that final encounter. The session went something like this. Keeper: The cave is filled with rocky pillars, and you will have to sneak up to the front. Rich: OK, what does the opposition look like that we can see from our current position? Keeper: you see a couple of thugs on either side of the altar and a crazy priest standing over the altar ``preparing'' a young woman for sacrifice. Eric: how do we know the priest is crazy? Keeper: you just can tell! It is the altar that really attracts your attention! Rich: Does the girl on the altar match the description of the one we are supposed to save, and do we have any clear shots at the guards on either side of the altar? Keeper: It *could* be the girl, but you notice that she is naked -- Rich: OK, we get the picture. Do we have clear shots at the guards and what is the floor composition like? Is it something we could sneak along? Keeper: She is bound to the altar, completely helpless, with straps of strong, black leather -- Eric and several others: Eeeeewwwww! Rich: Fine, now we take up positions to have Jim, Bob and Sam put suppressive fire on the guards while --- Keeper: She is moaning. She might be enjoying this! The priest is taking special cares in his ``preparation.'' He is standing *behind* the woman - -- Rich: Yes, we understand. Jim, Bob and Sam lay down suppressive fire while Tim and Bart rush the altar using the pillars as -- Keeper: The priest is disrobed from the waist down and he is -- The party as a whole: Eeeeewwww! Rich: FINE! We launch our attack as soon as we are -- Keeper: AND SHE IS FACE DOWN! -- Rich: OK, we understand! The party: No more! Eeeeewwwwww! After that ``face down'' became a slang phrase for any overzealous description or something gross. The payment at the inn ended up being a few dollars less than we had anticipated spending at the cabin, and the trip back was uneventful. As an epilog, I visited the dorm where Eric and Joey lived a couple of months ago, and people there still say ``not in my hotel'' and ``face down.'' They probably will never know where those phrases came from. :-) -THE END- ------------------------------ End of RQ Rules Digest: V2 #68 ****************************** This is the bottom of the RuneQuest Rules Digest. RuneQuest is a trademark of Avalon Hill, and Glorantha is a trademark of Chaosium. With the exception of previously copyrighted material, unless specified otherwise all text in this digest is copyright by the author or authors, with rights granted to copy for personal use, to excerpt in reviews and replies, and to archive unchanged for electronic retrieval. Send electronic mail to Majordomo@hops.wharton.upenn.edu with "help" in the body of the message for subscription information on this and other mailing lists. WWW material at http://hops.wharton.upenn.edu/~loren/rolegame.html